Episode 10: Dirty Details with Type 2 FunBassadors: No. 2

After a brief hiatus in March, Karey launches into April by sitting down with Type 2 FunBassadors with Aliza and Deann and talk about all things adventuring, food, and all of the things!  

Make sure to subscribe to the pod and check us out on Instagram for updates on Karey's adventures this summer and more!  Exciting things down the pipeline! 

Transcript

Karey: [00:00:00] Let's get started. So, uh, who do we have here? So we have our, um, FunBassador… squad…pod…whatever we wanna call it.

Aliza: Did you say twat pod? 

Deann: Squad.

Karey: Yeah. 

Deann: I don't know if I'm down with that one.

Karey: Okay, so our, our Dirty Details with the FunBassador crew here. Um, so tonight we have …

Deann: Deann Garcia,

Karey: and…

Aliza: …Oh, Aliza Richmond

Karey: of course

Aliza: of course. 

Deann: I love that it took you so long, like if there were another person on the call who might jump in. You're like, is it my turn?

Aliza: Just in case…

Karey: Oh my gosh, you guys, I'm so warm right now. I feel like I'm having hot flashes. It's bad. Anyway. 

Deann:It is possible.

Aliza: We are of an [00:01:00] age Karey. 

Karey: It’s just gonna sneak up on me. I'll tell you what.

Deann: There's a non-zero chance.

Karey: Yeah.. Anyway, so what do we wanna talk about? What are we going on? So we were just talking about, uh, before we got rolling….

Deann: We were talking about the high Cascades 100, which I am not doing.

Karey: Which you're not doing. Aliza a maybe, but when…

Aliza: A maybe 

Karey: When is it?

Aliza: July 20th. 

Karey: July 20th?

Aliza: Mm-Hmm,

Karey: And you said Brandi Carlisle is what day?

Aliza: July 21st.

Karey: That's more what I really care about right now.

Aliza: Well, you can come for the twofer to Bend, Oregon. Beautiful Bend, Oregon. Again, lodging is included.

Karey: Ooh, that sounds fantastic.

Aliza: Free of charge.

Karey: Ooh, bonus!

Deann: I will go cheer for you! 

Aliza: Double bonus![00:02:00] 

Karey: Oh my gosh… So Aliza, you are thinking about doing it?

Aliza: I'm thinking about it. I just don't know that I wanna pay for another very expensive race on top of the other expensive races I've signed up for this year, including the, which I just did. And, um, and then the Leadville 100, which was, which is like double the cost of the high Cascade 100.

Karey: Yeah.

Aliza: Yeah.

Karey: Yeah. It gets spendy.. Yeah.

Aliza: Mm-Hmm. 

Deann: Colorado

Karey: Yeah.

Aliza: Plus a trip to Colorado. Um, and then, yeah, actually I was gonna get your input. I'm kind of researching strategies on how to best acclimate or not for that.

Karey: That's a good topic. That's a good questionable,

Deann: Blood flow restriction.

Karey: Yeah.

Deann: That's what they say, right? Do the blood flow restriction on your legs and pedal [00:03:00] steady on the trainer for hours on end. 

Aliza: So Deann, why don't you explain blood flow restriction?

Deann: So when Aliza and I had our knee replacements, she introduced me to a concept called blood flow restriction, which ended up being like a total game changer for me and my recovery.

Essentially you strap these cuffs on your upper leg and then they're inflated to the point of the desired occlusion, so how much blood flow you want to get through. It essentially cuts off part of a large percentage of the blood flow to your legs. And, uh, it stimulates EPO production in the body from what I've read, and also kind of simulates oxygen deprivation in your muscles.

So you get used to exercising without sufficient oxygen. Um, and the EPO effect really increases muscle mass. So we both used it [00:04:00] after our surgeries to get our muscle back in our legs. And it also allows you to do exercises at body weight or very low weight, but with the effectiveness of like a max effort, so you don't have to stress your joints as much, but you still get a tremendous amount out of it.

Aliza: Mm-Hmm.

Karey: Wow.

Aliza: With that, it stimulates growth hormone, which helps with muscle production, but then it also increases autophagy, which is kind of the cellular cleanup of the body too. So it helps clean up debris in those regions of the body. And you could also do blood flow restriction in the upper extremity as well. Um, they have smaller cuffs for the arms.

Karey: Yeah, I did that when I was recovering from my, uh, shoulder injury, from my separated shoulder. I did blood flow restriction and I really think it helped, like, for sure. Yeah…Yeah. It's like a miracle…game changer.

Aliza: And then Deann has her own blood flow restriction [00:05:00] device. 

Deann: Yeah,yeah. So my physical therapist helped me get the numbers basically, it's kind of like a blood pressure cuff. So you just inflate it to a certain pressure. So when I was in PT, my therapist wrote down what the pressure numbers needed to be at different percentages of restriction and then I have like a hand pump version of it. So it was way cheaper. 'cause the ones they use at the therapist's office are like computerized automatic senses. Yeah. So I found one on the internet that it is just like you pump it with a hand pump. So it has a little dial, so I just do it to the numbers that the PT suggested.

I don't think that it'd be a good idea to just go do that on your own without knowing what those numbers are.

Karey: Kids, don't try this at home!

Deann: Yeah. Caveat! Um, but with that knowledge, I think mine was less than $200.

Karey: [00:06:00] Oh, that's awesome! That's really good to know. Well, yeah, so I've done it with two different PTs and the one had a machine and everything like that, which is nice 'cause if you wanna do it for like a certain amount of time you know, your 30 second reps or 15, whatever they had it set for. But then my other PT just did the hand pump one and it felt like the same result. So yeah, I just had to time myself on the efforts instead of the machine telling me when to stop or when to go.

Deann: mm-Hmm.

Karey: Well, that's pretty cool. I didn't even realize you could get that on the internet.

Deann: If you search for it on Amazon, you find all kinds of like, weird, um, devices that are just basically like a tourniquet and have girls with giant asses, and it's like, grow your ass with a tourniquet on your leg. And I'm like, that's not really what I'm looking for.

Aliza: But they are getting more affordable too, to get ones that are digital and not just mechanized with like, kind of like an old school blood pressure [00:07:00] cuff. So, but they are more expensive.

Karey: Yeah, totally. Well, that's super cool. Good. Well, so, okay, so back to…

Deann: To altitude.

Karey: Oh yeah. So we were talking about acclimating. Are you more worried about… 'cause it's gonna be in August, right?

Aliza: Mm-Hmm.

Karey: Are you more worried about heat or altitude or both?

Aliza: I'm more worried about the altitude. I mean, heat can be an issue, but it could also be really cold too. So it can actually be either extreme. But mostly it's the altitude. It's like starting at 10,000 feet. I live at sea level. That's really tough. Yeah, it's really tough. 

And, you know, and when we did the Colorado Trail. We spent like, you know, a few, a few days in Durango, but then we started in like Denver at like 5,000 feet. So we had like a few days more to acclimate. So it was really, [00:08:00] we had like a week of acclimation. And even with that, I think I still took Diamox. 

Karey: Yeah.

Aliza: When we did the Colorado Trail.

Karey: Yeah. So what have you found in your research so far? Like have you just started researching it?

Aliza: Yeah, it seems like you need it for more like two weeks to get the full benefit. Which is why, like what a lot of other athletes do is they just go like basically two days before, um, because that way they're not sacrificing their sleep and recovery and, you know, leading up to the race and then they just…basically you just expect that you can't hold the same wattage that you can at sea level so you have to calculate that and hold back when you are seeing the num if you're, if you are using a power meter like that, you are accounting for that during your pacing, during the race. 

And I just put my vacation request in, but I'm like the third priority, which is the, the lowest priority this year for vacation. But,, [00:09:00] if I had my way, basically I could get a week and a half before to start acclimating. So I think that's, I would, and then I would just kind of slowly work my way, like a little bit higher, just in the, you know, take the van out there, go to Moab, you know, go to Grand Junction and just kind of like, just go Crested Butte. Just like get to go some places and just like ride, because I'll be beginning my taper kind of around then too. But just doing like rides at those altitudes and sleeping at those altitudes a little bit higher each day.

Karey: I know there are some studies of whether you need to…I don't know if it's, whether people sleep at altitude and then do their workout otherwise, or vice versa, what is it? Or is it workout and then…

Aliza: So you wanna sleep you wanna sleep low and train high. 

Karey: Yeah. Okay. 

Aliza: Yeah. 

Karey: I mean, that's a big, a big thing.

Aliza: Yep.

Karey: Oh man.

Deann: How did you do with the altitude in Nepal?[00:10:00] 

Aliza: I did pretty well. But you know, it was very incremental. It was like 2,000 feet every day, and then we had like a rest day at 10,000 feet. So we spent like two nights at 10,000 feet. Um, and then again, just kind of increased by 2,000 feet every day. And, you know, the day we went up, up and over 18,000 feet, like that was definitely the hardest day. But I also was getting sick, so it was hard to know if it was just the altitude or being sick or both. And it was really cold too. So there were a lot of factors, but I really felt fine. At 10,000 feet, 12,000 feet, 14,000 feet, I really felt fine. Um, just with a minor headache and like a drop in appetite really.

Karey: Yeah.

Aliza: So I didn't do bad, I mean, didn't feel any sickness, but I did start taking Diamox at about 10,000 feet.

Karey: Yeah, I mean, that's the other thing I think to really be aware of, you know, no matter what you do for acclimation is like you just mentioned, your, your appetite is one of the first [00:11:00] things to go. I mean, I remember when we were getting ready for the Colorado Trail and, uh, we were in New Mexico. We did a route that was, it was just like three days, but we started at like 10k, and I think the highest was 12k. And I couldn't eat. And it wasn't just the bike packing sours, you know, like the sour stomach. I literally had no appetite. I was just like, I'm not hungry.Nothing really sounds good. Like it is what it is. So it was hard.

Aliza: So…can we talk about a controversial subject?

Karey: Oooooh, yes! 

Aliza: What are the rules when it comes to. THC/CBD in events like this

Deann: Hmm. 

Aliza: Not only are they helpful, like Deann and I experienced when we did the Big Lonely, getting you through some really tough times, but it also helps with appetite.

Deann: Hmm.

Karey:  I mean…

Aliza: I mean, I'm not a professional athlete. I'm not gonna win this

Karey: Right?

Deann: Is it…

Aliza:  What are the rules? 

Deann: Yeah. Who sanctions [00:12:00] this race? 

Karey: Yeah, 

Aliza: Lifetime promoters,

Deann: I mean, if it's not USAC, then it's fine. Right?

Aliza: Yeah. I mean it's like its own category. A hundred mile, you know, mountain bike race. 

Karey: What nobody knows, don’t kill ‘em. 

Deann: Nobody knows. So…

Aliza: By the way, do you wanna hear a side note that kind of blew my mind? At grocery stores in Minneapolis, Minnesota, you can buy beverages that have THC and CBD in them. But it has THC and it's in a grocery store.

Deann: What?

Aliza: And it blew my mind. And Jeanette was like, oh, I guess Minneapolis has something Portland doesn't, you know. She was all happy. But I was blown away that it was a grocery store. You just took your ID when you got it. But it wasn't like in a weed shop or in a liquor store. And, by the way, you can't buy beer at grocery [00:13:00] stores in Minneapolis or wine.

Karey: What?

Aliza:But you can buy THC in a beverage.

Deann: That doesn't make any sense.

Karey: That's so weird. 

Aliza: Isn't that the most bizarre thing ever?

Deann: I mean, that's actually, in a lot of ways, that's actually like way more logical than everybody else's restricted substance laws, given that alcohol makes people go insane and weed does not. 

Karey: That's crazy.

Aliza: I will say I bought one of those beverages and had it before getting on the plane, and that actually was really nice.

Karey: Oh. 

Aliza: It was kind of one of the best plane rides I've had in a while.

Deann: They can't stop you if it's in your body.

Aliza: I know.

Deann: You could cross those state lines.

Karey: Oh yeah. Federal!

Deann: Just eat it. Just eat it.

Aliza: I didn't bring it on the plane or it to the airport. I just drank it before I went to the airport.

Karey: You’re like… chugging it right in front of the TSA folks. 

Aliza: Yeah. 

Deann: Oh my….

Karey: Oh my [00:14:00] gosh. So funny!

Deann: Hot tip! I'm gonna keep that one in my back pocket!

Karey: Yeah. 

Aliza: Yeah. Now you know, the more you know, the more you know.

Karey: Oh my gosh. Oh, I'm glad you had a good ride, Aliza.

Aliza: Yeah. Thank you. But anyways, getting back to Leadville, I mean, is that. I mean, that's a strategy that I was thinking of employing for that for help with calories and eating.

Karey: Yeah, I mean, as long as you practice with it. I mean, the biggest thing is don't try anything new on race day, you know? And even if you can experience at least one high altitude, because it's gonna affect you more at high altitude as well. So just make sure you don't get stoned off your ass and try to ride your bike for 100 whatever miles.

Aliza: Deann, what did we do for Big Lonely? How much was that?

Deann: So we had 5mg gummies and we were taking like, half… maybe 

Karey: Oh, okay. How often? [00:15:00] 

Aliza: I just did it once.

Deann: Oh! I did it like every two hours! There was one point, one point where I felt head high, just a tiny bit, and I was like, oh, back it off. 

Karey: She’s over there in the bushes…[laughing really hard] 

Deann: You guys! No, I made a point of like, oh, try to keep it below where I would feel anything

Karey: Yeah.

Deann: Okay, so I don't know if this is a good strategy though because in the end I ended up seriously injuring my hand. So maybe not feeling pain is a signal that your body doesn't like something. 

Karey: Totally. 

Deann: Maybe numbing that pain is not always the best strategy.

Aliza: Ahhh… good point.

Karey: It's a means to an end though. I mean, I guess you could have called for help and like abandoned…

Deann: I wasn't gonna quit.

Karey: Yeah, exactly.

Deann: I was finishing [00:16:00] that race 

Karey: Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So…

Deann: I will cross the finish line, carry my bike on my back. I was gonna finish.

Karey: Oh my gosh. Wow. So Aliza, for your training for, um…

Aliza: Leadville?

Karey: For your training for Leadville, are you gonna do most of your training in Bend or like how are you or does it just depend on where you are?

Aliza: Yeah, it kind of works out like a lot of my training is in Bend, however, I can't get up to the higher elevations, like until July, really, 'cause there's snow and they've be getting a lot of snow the last few weeks.

Karey: Yep.

Aliza: I mean, so my house in Bend is like just under 4,000 feet. It's like 3000 something. And then, you know, um, like Paulina is 8,000 feet. You get up towards bachelor, it's like 6,000.

Karey: Mm-Hmm.

Aliza: So it's not [00:17:00] super high.

Karey: Okay.

Aliza: Yeah.

Karey: I mean, you could always come down here some more.

Aliza: Do the Lemmon Drop?

Karey: We could meet, yeah. We could do Mount Lemmon. We could do..there's a lot of different up high places we could do, we could meet in New Mexico. That would be great.

Aliza: Um, it's just all about finding the vacation I end up getting. 

Karey: Yeah.

Aliza: That's the tough thing.

Karey: Stupid work.

Aliza: Stupid work. But I have a strategy for next year

Karey: Yeah?

Aliza: Yeah, to work one week a month.

Karey: What.

Aliza: I'll have to work, it'll be like seven days in a row of, you know, my long days, but then I'll be off for the rest of the month.

Karey: Wow. Good for you.

Deann: I mean, if you think you could still be functional on day six and seven, then you should do it! [00:18:00] 

Aliza: I know, I'm still trying to work out those details of how that's gonna work,

Karey: Oh my gosh.

Aliza: But, um, but then that'd be less driving back and forth and then hopefully I can, have more time in Bend and more time traveling.

Karey: Yeah. Exactly.

Deann: It’ll line up perfectly for when we do the Atlas Mountain race.

Aliza: Yep. Does Karey know about this?

Deann: I've been, I've been obsessively following the dots, but…

Karey: Remind me what it is.

Deann: So Atlas Mountain Race is one of Nelson Tree's big races. He does the Panhellenic and the Silk Road also. Um, Atlas Mountain is 1300 kilometers, , from Marrakech to Essaouira, and it crosses the Atlas and Anti-Atlas Mountains, and it just happened like two weeks ago.

[00:19:00] So the thing is that there's actually like a cutoff time, so I think it's eight days. You have to finish it in eight days, and then there's a huge party at the end. So I like that because it makes it not just about winning, but also just everybody who finishes under the eight days is a winner.

And a lot of times, the top race racers will stick around for the end. But I think, uh, Justina, who was second at the Tour Divide this year, uh, he won it. So he was second twice, two years prior and then finally won it this year. And it was like a freaking drag race. Like he was against, up against this guy named Drikus Coetzee.  He is a Namibian dude who is first time in an ultra like that. And the two of them were within a few kilometers of each other all the way up until like 50 k to [00:20:00] go. And basically he collapsed from exhaustion and he had a crash and was severely dehydrated. He made it like 1,250 miles. And then had to drop out.

So Justinas won the race on the men's side. Cynthia Carson won on the women's side, and there were a few women who were close to her for a while, but it seemed like there was a lot of illness that went through the peloton. And a couple of the top women who would've been challenging her got sick.

And most of them finished, but they were just riding slow at a certain point. Um, so she won that pretty handily, but I think it's like just under four days for the men and, uh, four and a half for Cynthia, if I remember right. But they do a really good job of promoting the race on social media.

So there's a podcast, um, that was just interviews with the riders every day that [00:21:00] dropped. It was like an hour. They had this whole media crew that was like out on the road. They have better rules on ultras in other countries than they do in America. 

Controversial subject! American ultra rules are stupid and sexist! But… 

Aliza: You heard it here first! From the Type 2 FunBassadors! 

Deann: I got a problem, I got a problem with these rules!

So yeah, there was a guy,  Alan Shaw, who has a delightful accent also. He was out interviewing people and then they were putting out like a podcast that was just like sort of the sights and sounds of the AMR. A lot of the mid-pack people, they kind of were going back and forth, so it was like tons of different riders got a chance to talk and it really gives you a good view of like the ups and downs of a race like that and how a person can, like one day being like, I'm thinking about dropping out, and then 12 hours later they'll be like, yeah, when I saw you a few days ago, I was feeling pretty [00:22:00] bad. And Alan Shaw would be like, it was like five hours ago….Wait, what? But like, you know, you're in this time warp 'cause nobody's sleeping.

Yeah. It was really cool to watch. But that's 2026 Atlas Mountain Race

Karey: Wow.

Deann: Doing it!

Karey: I will be cheering for you.

Aliza: Team Total Knee for Speed!

Karey: Oh yeah. Team redemption. Aw!

Deann: Yep.

Karey: That would be awesome.

Deann: And actually, 

Aliza: Karey, you might, sounds like you might be, uh, joining the team soon too? 

Karey: Nope, Nope, nope, nope, nope, nope. My knee is…is in repair. I'm not gonna say it's 100%, but it is in repair. My knee did not… like the right knee that I was having issues with, I did not feel it once during the race.

Deann: Wow.

Karey: During the 60 K…Yeah. Yeah. I, um, I had other issues, but, [00:23:00] but that knee specifically was good. So my PT… just changing the subject a little bit…My PT, Meghan, she is like an ultra runner extraordinaire. She knows all the things. And anyway, every time I go in she dry needles me and it's like, she's like, okay, where is it? You know? And she'll feel around and do a bunch of body work. And then she dry needles. And it was so funny 'cause it was the Tuesday before the race and she had done a couple spots on my leg and she's like, I'm not satisfied with what I'm getting from this quad, like right above the knee. And she's like, I know there's something else. And so she's kind of feeling around and then she hit the spot and I was like, that might be it. And so she like goes and she's being, you know, like very exact and she's like, ah. And all of a sudden my whole leg just spasms. And she is like, Whoa!

And she has a PT doc student that's there with her, and she was like, Oh my God! I like, felt that clear over here! And anyway, so it was like, it was like a miracle. I think that specific muscle was like the one that had been just like holding on for dear life and like, it was a little tendy after that. And then during the race, I didn't feel it at all. So, and it's been okay since, I mean, it's a little, like when I do a deep squat I can feel some like, you know, stiffness in there, but yeah. So…

Deann: Wild!

Karey: Yeah, it's a miracle.

Deann: That's awesome

Karey: Yeah,

Aliza: Did you watch Heather Jackson's video about Black Canyon? 

Karey: I haven't watched her video yet. I mean, I watched the race go down, but, no. 

Aliza: Yeah. Um, well it was good. I just watched it today and I [00:25:00] wanted to ask you about it, but, um, made me think of you obviously, 'cause I haven't really heard of your race report yet from Black Canyon. Um, I'm not sure if you did another podcast about that, but 

Karey: Yeah, we can talk a little bit about it. 

Aliza: Yeah, I wanna hear out one, but before you do, like, what I'll say about Heather Jackson, she, you know, she's professional and whatever, like, you know, she kind of went for it and then, made some mistakes and then she's kind of exploded. Um, but then she knew she wasn't gonna win. She knew she wasn't gonna have a great result, but she finished the race and she did it smiling. And I think that was like, I don't know, that was the coolest thing that she still put out that video and it was still so positive even though she knew she didn't have a competitive result.

Karey: Totally. Because I think it'd be very tempting…I was thinking that as well, you could tell from watching it go down, like when [00:26:00] it happened or like subsequent things happened and all of a sudden she was just out of the running. Right? And you know, you're always like, oh, what happened? Did she get injured? Did she get, you know, like dah dah, dah, and I saw some of her posts or whatever. 

I think it, there really is something to say about when you keep racing not for the win. You know what I mean? Because especially with a professional career and where there's other races that you really have to be like, okay, is it worth finishing? Is it worth it? How do I finish? Do I bury myself if I'm already buried? Do I keep going? Because it could mean you are burying myself more for that next race. You know, those are hard decisions. But yeah, that's super awesome for her. I think it's really cool to be able to do that mentally.

Deann: Mm-Hmm.

Aliza: Yeah, it was like really it was a mental exercise to be able to finish that when you know that you are struggling and, you know, she was having nutrition issues and [00:27:00] she got behind and, you know, there was snow, right? Like, and everything got delayed and she forgot to eat like another meal before the race. 

Karey: And that can, I mean, that can make or break a race right there, especially when you're going that hard and you're really leaving out there and you planned like everything to a tee. You know, and obviously that's part of it. I think especially…we talked about this before…like with the ultras and everything where you plan and plan and plan, but then eventually you're just gonna get to plan C or D or Z at some point because it's not gonna go…it doesn't ever go exactly the way you want it. 

But I mean, it was way different when we started. The next day, um, it was still just as cold, but yeah, basically they had snow on the ground and significant ice and snow. Um, and so they made them wait for like two and a half hours. I think it was like delayed an hour.

And then they had them delay more. And mind you, at the start, like there is no, [00:28:00] like at the, at the start of the school, like there's like porta-potties and then there was like. Nothing. And so it's like, it was a big conundrum and we're talking like the 100k race was maxed out at like over a thousand people.

Deann: Whoa!

Karey: Like that's how big this race is, you know what I mean? So anyway, but by the time they started them, then it was mud because it had thawed and so like. I mean, if you look at the pictures from the 100k race, it's like everybody has bloody knees…

Deann: Oh no!

Karey: And elbows and like, I was just like, oh my God. But like for us, when we started, it was, um, we started on time, so it was 7:00 in the morning. It was like 29 degrees when we started, and there were winds from like 8-10 mph. And it was freaking crazy. But it was not muddy because everything was frozen. But what we dealt with was like, you know, when there's [00:29:00] like cattle on a wet trail and then it hardens and you have like the footprints and like all that ruddy stuff. So that's what we were running in, um, for basically the first probably seven miles. So it was like an ankle roll central. Like you had to be really careful. Like, and when, when we started around the track, there were patches of ice, but it wasn't, I mean, you could kind of navigate, everybody was really good about being like, watch out,... But it was, it was tricky. It was a little crazy. Yeah, but I was, I was glad not to have to run in that mud. It looked insane. 

Deann: So, did it go according to your plan?

Karey: Yes, except that it took longer than I thought it would. I took longer than I thought I would, but not for any reason except for that it's a hard course and I really [00:30:00] paced conservatively on purpose, you know what I mean? Um, I didn't have anything that…Like I said, when going into it, you know, I was having the little knee stuff and like my posterior tib muscle, like around the inside of my left ankle had been hurting pretty badly. They were really tender. Um, so I was kind of babying that. And this course is notorious for like, really getting the ankles, because it's like all single track, pretty much, except for the first three miles and like the last few miles. So it's like a rugged single track, like a very raw single track. So I was dealing with that and so I was nervous that I might not be able to finish. I was just like, well, I'm just gonna keep going. And so, yeah. So everything went really well. I paced really well. 

I kind of started toward the back of the middle pack. When you start it's like, just like an open road, dirt road, and it's kind of uphill and like [00:31:00] starting, you all know for me, I'm like, I don't wanna start on an uphill. Are you kidding me? Like, it's like, it's horrible and 29 degrees outside. My legs are like little ice cubes. Like, no. So I just kind of was like, it's okay, I'll catch up to people. And I did later, like it was fine, but that also meant that we jumped on the single track and I was, I think I was kind of behind, some people that were probably my speed, but then some people that were in front the Congo line, if you will, that were you know… I kind of wanted to go a little faster at times, but who knows? Like, maybe it helped me pace. I don't know. You know, maybe I would've gone out too hard. I don't know. 

But all in all, it went really well. I probably could have eaten more. My stomach was a little off, but it was okay. Um. I just kept going and going. I would say the hardest part was like at the halfway mark at, 20 miles is where the aid station is, where you can have your crew. So Patty was crewing for [00:32:00] me. And so I sat down and for a second and was trying to eat something and was doing my feet and like, you know, 'cause I changed socks, lube up my feet with the Vaseline or bag bomb or whatever, and then like put my socks back on, changed my shoes. I have a different vest, like a whole thing. And I went to stand up again and I literally thought I wasn't gonna be able to run again, ever. Like, I was so stiff.  I was like, oh my gosh. So if any moment was like low, it was that. 

So that's Bumblebee aid station, you have to run down into it, it's like a ranch and then you have to run out of it. And so that was, that was rough. That's probably the most walking that I did was like that little portion. And then finally I was like, okay Karey, you've gotta start running at some point. Like, if you can run then you should run. But I put my music in, my earbuds on, on my earbuds and I was like, okay, just run for this one song. You know, like that kind of a thing to try to get me. But then, you know, and then it kind of goes up and down. So then by the time the song was over, I was kind of like [00:33:00] descending a little bit and I was like, well, I can't stop running now, you know? So it got me, it got me back on.

And then you get like in these little pods of people that you're kind of running with for a while, which is really motivating. And I met some really cool people on the trail. And then, I finished really strong. Like, um, I finished running and I finished like, um, you have to go down to this stupid river, which is janky. And then you just turn around and you come back, which is horrible. And um, and I ran like all the way up it pretty much, which was surprising to me 'cause the whole way down I was like, oh my gosh, like this is gonna suck coming back up. But I turned around I had more energy than I thought. My legs were still working and yeah, my goal was eight hours. And I think I got it in like 8:29 or 8:39…or something like that. 

Aliza:  I think it was 8:29. I looked at your result and I was like, oh my god. Eight and a half hours. That's so great. And I was like wondering if you were like, [00:34:00] it was 8:29, like it wasn't eight and a half hours. 

Karey: Oh no. I was like, I was like, damnit, I wanted eight.

Aliza: No, I was like, I was so impressed that it was like within a day.

Deann: Yeah, I mean, that's within, that's within 6%, right? Of your goal time, like that's not that bad.

Karey: Yeah. No, I mean really like, and the other thing is, is like I was comparing to, and again, I don't know, I think there were still some course records out there, whatever, but it's kind of a new course because we finished at a different location, so they had to add on that out and back. So it made it a little bit different because the out and back is just like an open gravel road, which is just like we go up and then down and then up. And it was actually harder, I thought, than the single track because the single track is made for horses and hiking and you know, like that kinda stuff. So there's short little peaks, but like, not like this, like clear up and clear [00:35:00] down. 

Um, but anyway, so, you know, who am I comparing to last year's results or, you know, other year's results of mid-pack is what I was kind of estimating and. So I'd say not that far off. So I'm, I'm very happy and all in all, I'm not like complaining. I'm very proud of what I did and, and my, like I said, my knee held up, my post tib held up. Like I didn't trip and fall on my face. It's such a technical course. I mean, okay… I did trip like five different times, but I was able to keep it up like every time.

Aliza: Was that one of your goals? Like to, to fall fewer than a number of times? Because I had that goal for the Burkey. My goal was to wipe out fewer than three to five times. 

Karey: Did you reach your goal?

Aliza: I did!

Karey: Good job?

Deann: What was your total?

Aliza: Two, but one of them was like a total superman you know, if it just went flying through the air. I was like, my skis were up in the air, like [00:36:00] my legs were bent. And I was like, it was, I was going down this hill and, you know, it was like 40 degrees at the Burkey. And the first lap was kind of cold still. The second lap things started warming up. So I was going down a hill and I hit a section of snow that kind of slowed down. So my skis stopped, but my body kept going forward. And so I just like Superman it, or super Jew'd it, if you will. And I slid down, I slid down the rest of the hill on my belly with my legs and skis up in the air, but didn't lose my skis, didn't lose my pole. I even had an AirPod in and didn't lose my AirPod.

Karey: Hey, that's a win. That's a win right there,

Aliza: It was a win. Yeah.

Karey: Aliza. I wish it would've been like right through the finish line though. I feel like that would've been amazing. 

Aliza: Well that was last year when I fell my butt going into the finish. So that was actually one of, before I knew the course would be [00:37:00] changed. That was my main goal: don't fall on Main Street like I did last year in front of thousands of people. But instead I just like Superman it in front of just like maybe 15.

Deann: You made it count.

Karey: Did they “Wooo” ? Or what did they do?

Aliza: Yeah. So, um, well the spectators were silent 'cause they're like, what just happened? She, okay. Like they didn't even ask if I was okay. I think they were just in shock about what exactly happened. Um, and then this guy comes like screaming behind me and he was like, Hey, nice wipe out. And I was like, Thanks! And then I kind of looked back to like, get up. 'cause like I made this mistake last year when I fell. I put my pole out and I totally took some guy out with me like he was going down the hill. So I was very careful. I looked back, no one was coming. So I got up and when I started going and another guy did the exact same thing, he wiped [00:38:00] out in the exact same spot.

Karey: Oh no!

Aliza: So yeah, it was just, uh, yeah, just very challenging snow conditions. 'cause it was man made snow and it was 40 degrees.

Karey: You had to do three laps, right? Is that correct? Were they 10k laps?

Aliza: Yeah, three laps. Mm-Hmm, 30k.

Karey: I mean, besides the conditions, was it really hard? Were you still trying to go all out? Was it different than last time? Like how did you feel?

Aliza: Well, yeah, I felt like I just was not great with those conditions, and I just felt like I was just fighting the snow. I was fighting the conditions. My best friend Jeanette, her husband, he waxed my skis and it was like the best wax job that I could have. I did like all the things I like, got my skins prepared and cleaned and I did all the things, but because of just my skill level and the skis and the conditions, I had this terrible combination of no glide on my skis, [00:39:00] but then also no kick. I would slip when I tried to kick, but then I couldn't glide either when I went to try to ski. 

Deann: That’s literally the opposite of what you're looking for.

Aliza: Yeah, you want to glide and you want to kick and I had zero, I had neither. So it was just kind of like, well, I'm just gonna do my best and finish this race. But I accomplished all my goals though. Yeah. I, so my goals were to finish, or sorry, number one was to not get injured. Number two was to finish. Number three was to fall fewer than three to five times.

Deann: Check, check, check.

Aliza: And number four was to finish in under three hours. And so I did all those.

Deann: Yay.

Aliza: Yeah. Even giving in the conditions. So I was happy with that. Um, but I did feel like I wasn’t really going all out, like racing. I felt like I was like just getting through.

Karey: Yeah, totally. Oh my gosh. Well, good for you if we're still doing that. I mean, I know that's, again, it's like [00:40:00] you could just throw in the towel since it's not the whole bit, you know what I mean? And conditions aren't good, but you know, it's also fun to have, you go out there with friends. I know you're not out there with the people who are skating, like Jess and Sue and stuff, but at least you're all there together.

Aliza: We all that together, we saw Jesse Diggins win the Burkie, which was pretty exciting. We saw Gus Schumacher win the Burkie, and I mean, it was like, it was a big festival. It was super fun still, you know, despite all that. And on a scale from one to 10, I was asked on a scale from one in 10, how likely am I to do it next year? And I said, 20. I'll do it next year.

Karey: Well hopefully it snows next here.

Aliza: Hopefully next year it'll get snow and it'll be better conditions and I'll maybe, hopefully I'll be better. I won't have injury with my achilles like right before, you know.

Karey: How was your achilles and how was it during the race? Like was it Okay?

Aliza: It was okay. I mean, it wasn't a hundred percent. Um, I definitely was cautious and I felt very [00:41:00] stiff with my technique 'cause I think I was just nervous about aggravating it. So, I mean, I saw like all the pictures, you know, that you can search your bib number and you see all the pictures of yourself and every picture I look like, I'm like, like constipated, like I'm just like all stiff, you know, like in these weird, like awkward positions. I do not look like a skier at all. Looks terrible. I'm like, yeah. I think I have some things to work on for next year.

Karey: That's goal number one: do not look constipated for the pictures. 

Aliza: Don't constipated when I'm on the skis. 

Karey: haha 

Aliza: It was pretty bad. 

Karey: Oh my gosh. That's awesome! 

Deann, I saw that you are getting back on the bike!

Deann: Yeah. Yeah. So it's feeling pretty good. I talked about this in one of our early podcasts about how my hand went numb after Big Lonely. Um, well, it's still [00:42:00] a little numb. My first two fingers are still numb, just above the second knuckle. Um, so that's a considerable improvement. But I've had quite a saga with the medical establishment trying to figure out what the hell is wrong with me. Um, I had like a nerve conduction study that was shockingly painful, ….bah-dum-chhhh…

Karey: Oh, I was gonna say, did they? Yeah. Is that okay?

Deann: Yeah…

Aliza: Shockingly painful, hah! 

Deann: Yeah, And I felt a little lied too. I was told it's uncomfortable. And then when I actually got there, then the doctor was like, it's more than uncomfortable, it's gonna really hurt. Sorry, all the way up my arm and your hands like spasming and doing all these crazy things. And uh, and then apparently it just said like, yeah, you have a problem in your medial nerve. And I was like, wait, that's all. Because I could have told you that because that is exactly where I am numb. But. $800 and a horrible morning [00:43:00] later. It is confirmed.

Karey: Oh,

Deann: Then I started some PT for that. Uh, I had a cortisone shot that did nothing. Um, been apparently taking the wrong B vitamins because I had a not awesome experience with a hand specialist that gave me roughly 15 minutes of his time, rattled off some stuff, put a shot in my hand, and then sent me on my way and didn't, I didn't get like notes from the visit or anything. Thought he told me to take the B12. Apparently it was B6. So for like the last six weeks I've been shoveling B12 into my body for no good reason, I guess,

Karey: That's still good for your brain though, right? 

Deann: I think. I guess it's like good for anti-fatigue, things like that. I don't know. Yeah. So whatever. But I just switched to B6 like a couple days ago when they called me back out of the blue and they were like, we wanna get you set scheduled for surgery. And I was like, I'm not sorry, I'm not having surgery. Don't talk to me again. I'm not doing that. [00:44:00] Um, because now my working theory from the physical therapist is that I had something called a double crush, which is where you both damage it in your hand, but also in your neck. Um, and they think that I have a lot of symptoms that kind of align with a bulging disc in my C6 [vertebra] so I am now doing all of these like traction kind of things to try to get my disc back in place in my neck, but is like, there's no pain affiliated with it at all. It's just like. So this happened because I got a new gravel bike and then I went to do a bike fit at the physical therapist.

So my hand therapist and this guy, this guy who did the bike fit, who also just happened to be a neck specialist, they were sort of working together on my fit. And he was like, well, are you sure it's her hand? And she was like, no, but she was having vertigo before, so I couldn't do the neck test. And then they were like, when do you get vertigo?

And I was like, I don't know, it's random. Comes and [00:45:00] goes. And they said, does the Epley maneuver work? And I was like, no, not at all. And they were like, you know, uh, vertigo is not always caused by your ears. Sometimes it's caused in your neck and if the Epley maneuver doesn't work, it probably means it's your neck.

So I'm like, oh, great. Okay. So, they were like, all right, we're gonna need to start doing neck stuff. So now I'm kind of seeing the two therapists are like tag teaming on me and we're working on both the hand and the neck at the same time. Um, but I'm cleared to go back to biking and I. Did a couple of rides this past weekend. Gotta get these callouses back on my ass. That was the worst part.

Karey: Same boat. I am in the same boat.

Deann: It sucks. You pull out your $250 shammy and you're like, this thing doesn't even work! But I'm working my way back now and I am, yeah. Okay. Like this thing where I tilt my head over to the left, by the way, is like part of my problem. So I'm like [00:46:00] seeing myself on the video here and trying to keep my head in line, um, trying to, 'cause I need to improve my posture and I'm lopsided, so…

Karey: Here, we'll sit up nice and tall. 

Deann: If anyone sees me doing this, tell me to stop it.

Karey: It's alright.

Deann: Yeah. None of this stuff seems to be getting irritated by riding my bike at the moment, but I haven't been on a trail. I'm riding drop at the moment, but it's not trail season here anyway. It's just a mud pit, so…

Karey: Totally. Yeah. Well, good. Oh my gosh. Well, now that you have a gravel bike, we need to find some gravel adventures to all go on together. Yeah.

Deann: Aliza wants me to race the Cascade Gravel Grind, or wait, is it Cascade or Gorge? 

Aliza: The, the Gorge. The Gorge Gravel grinder.

Deann: Yeah,  I'm afraid it might be a little quick for me to get into shape for it, but I'm gonna, I'm gonna try and then make the call at the last second.

Karey: Aliza's just starting to get into shape, or at least that's what she [00:47:00] told me.

Aliza: Yeah. Yeah. Just today was my first, uh, trainer specific workout for bike season.

Karey: Woo.

Deann: That's exciting.

Aliza: Yep.

Karey: She’s like, Good for you.

Aliza: I'm excited to switch gears. Karey, you excited to switch gears? 

Karey: Yeah. No, I'm really excited. Like we did a big ride or a big-ish technical ride on Saturday, and I actually was feeling good. I think that the one nice thing is fitness-wise and like my body strength transitions pretty well from running to riding, but not vice versa. You know what I mean?

 So that's been really good. Um, but then I think it took more outta me than I thought 'cause then we're starting…Sundays are Patty and my adventure ride day or long rides. So then we went and did a ride called Around the Mountain around South Mountain and it's like 30 miles and it's partially, I would say two thirds trail and [00:48:00] then one third like, uh, dirt or paved road or whatever back. But anyway, I absolutely died. I've done the route a few other times and last time I did it by myself and I was pretty fit 'cause I think it was like going into, it wasn't Colorado Trail, but it was like going into something else…Oh yeah, training for RAAZ was the last time I did it and I was much more fit and I like walked so many things and Patty was just waiting for me the whole time. He's so good. But I was like, babe, this is just that one ride where I just have to suffer and like break the seal, you know?

Aliza: Yeah.

Karey: And my, like you said, like my ass was so sore. Like it's still just like, It makes me realize like, you know, it makes you realize what you don't use when you're doing something else, right? Like the hands and like the triceps and like, you know, your butt and like, just like, oh, the break in period. But, but I am! I'm [00:49:00] very excited. 

But I also did just hire a running coach, so, yeah. But, which I'm really excited about. We're gonna start in a couple weeks, but, um, she's gonna kind of help me navigate like I. Continuing some of my running fitness and trying to do strengthening and stuff like that and work on speed. So then when the running season, like my fall running season comes, I can start on the longer miles, but I think it'll really help me to try to balance both 'cause she knows what I'm doing.

Like for, 'cause we're training for RAAZ in May. Um, and so the Ride Across Arizona for those who don't know what that is, um, anyway, so we're training for that again. So I think it'll be really helpful to like, have her help me navigate, like not overworking myself on any given workout or thing or, you know, trying to do all the things. So, yeah. So it'll mostly be like shorter workouts and like a strength program and stuff like that. So anyway, yeah, I'm excited.

Deann: Strength is where it's at. I've [00:50:00] been, I've been working with a trainer for the last two months and it's been awesome.

Karey: Oh, that's really cool.

Deann: Yeah, like just doing, trying to do injury prevention.

Karey: Yeah. Totally. It goes a long way.

Deann: Yeah.

Karey: Well, awesome. Is there anything else going on soon for either of you besides training and getting back at it?

Deann: I'm gonna go to Tennessee next week, visit my little sister, and then hopefully get in a day on the bike out there. We've never been to Tennessee before, but Knoxville is where she's at, and there 

Karey: Oh yeah. 

Deann: There are some trails like in town basically looks like there's quite a bit, so we’ll see what they’ve got. 

Karey: Will you rent bikes or bring bikes?

Deann: Rent. 

Karey: Okay, cool. Yeah.

Deann: Yeah. And then also a trip to Dollywood because, I couldn't not do that.

Karey: Yeah. 

Aliza: Is that in Knoxville?

Deann: Yeah. Well it's in Pigeon Forge, which is like an hour and a half outside of Knoxville.

Karey: Yeah. Oh, my gosh. So much fun. 

Deann: And then Aliza [00:51:00] and I are gonna go watch the eclipse together in San Antonio pretty soon too. 

Aliza: Yeah.

Deann: For anyone who's unaware, there's a total solar eclipse crossing the United States on April 8th, and if you're in the path, you should definitely make a point of going to see it. Mm-Hmm.

Karey: Yep.

Aliza: Yeah. One of my biggest regrets is not seeing it when it was in Oregon. I stayed in Portland, which was like 97% and I thought that would be like, just as cool and it was not as cool. 

Deann: Do not delude yourself into thinking that 99% is only 1% less good. It's not, it's not even in the same universe.

Aliza: Although I saw that eclipse with Karey

Deann: Aw.

Aliza: And then I get to see this one, this one with you, Deann.

Deann: Aw, Karey, you guys should just drive out.

Karey: Is that the the one where we were in the backyard trying to do wheelies?

Aliza: Yeah, That's my biggest memory of that too, is like wheelies in a very disappointing eclipse. The wheelies were the highlight of the day.[00:52:00] 

Deann: Wow.

Karey: So funny. Oh my gosh. What a good memory. Well, hopefully you'll be doing wheelies for wheel this time on your bike. Oh my gosh. And then I'll be seeing Aliza. What is today's date? Less than a month.

Aliza: Less than a month, like three weeks

Karey: Yep.

Aliza: Karey’s gonna kick my butt into shape.

Karey: Yep. We got some good stuff planned. Aliza. I'm telling you, it's gonna kick my butt too. So.

Aliza: Perfect.

Karey: It'll be great. We'll suffer together.

Aliza: Good.

Karey: And then I also get to go to Sedona Fest next week.

Deann: Ooh.

Karey: Yeah. Sedona Mountain Bike Fest. So that'll be fun.

Aliza: Oh, nice.

Karey: Yeah, I'm super stoked. I think I'm gonna try, last time that I went, I didn't go last year, but the year before I went, um, and I just did rides with like all the regular people, but, well actually I led a ride for trail monos for the glove [00:53:00] people. But anyway, um, but this year I don't have to lead anything, but I think I'm gonna try to get out and go represent on some ladies stuff I think there's gonna be a, a good, a solid group of women there, uh, at least from the Phoenix area and beyond.

So I'm pretty excited. So gotta go represent the ladies.

Deann: Nice.

Karey: Yeah. Well the

Deann: Go rep the pod!

Karey: Yep. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly. All right, perfect. Well, happy trails and I'll see you soon, Aliza. I'll talk to you soon. Deann.

Deann: Alright. Sounds good.

Aliza: Okay. Signing out!